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jevers
Administrator
USA
1367 Posts |
 Posted - 02/26/2011 : 10:34:44 PM
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CINCINNATI, Ohio - The Kalamazoo Wings (29-20-2-4) jumped out to an early 3-0 lead and never looked back as they cruised past the Cincinnati Cyclones (24-22-6-3) by a 5-1 final score at Wings Stadium on Saturday night.
For just the third time this season, the Cyclones fell into a 3-0 hole in the span of about six minutes; the first tally came at the 3:00 mark when Kory Karlander picked up a turnover in the Cincinnati zone and wristed one past Chet Pickard (L, 8 saves, 9-12-2-1) for a 1-0 lead. Justin Taylor and Andrew Fournier then followed with goals at 8:14 and 8:49 respectively to extend the early Kalamazoo cushion. Luckily, Cincinnati temporarily stopped the bleeding at 13:52 when Paul McIlveen poked a bouncing puck past Wings netminder Ryan Nie (W, 40 saves, 23-13-2-3), making it 3-1. However, with just under a minute to play in the period, A.J. Thelen sent a slap shot past Pickard on the power play to give the Wings a 4-1 advantage heading into the first intermission.
During a penalty filled second period, the Wings added to their lead at the 10:06 mark on a power play goal from Justin Taylor making it 5-1 Kalamazoo. Brian Foster (ND, 22 saves, 2-1-0) came on in relief of Pickard and turned aside nine of 22 of 23 shots in the final two period.
In the third, Cincinnati peppered Nie with 19 more shots but could not find the twine as the Wings held on to a 5-1 win. With the victory, Kalamazoo is now 8-0-0-1 in their last nine games and extend their lead in the North Division standings to seven points over the Cyclones. Cincinnati is still winless this season at Wings Stadium, going 0-2-1-1.
The Cyclones Radio Network Three Stars of the Game are as follows:
1. Ryan Nie (Winning goaltender, 40 saves for Kalamazoo)
2. Justin Taylor (2 goals for Kalamazoo)
3. A.J. Thelen (1 goal for Kalamazoo)
The defending Kelly Cup Champions will return to U.S. Bank Arena Wednesday, March 2, when they welcome in the Reading Royals for the final time in 2010-11. It will also be the final Wet Wednesday of the season with $1 PBR and Miller High Life flowing all night long. 2010-11 single game and discounted group tickets are available now. 2011-12 season tickets go on sale to the general public on March 5. For more information, call 513.421.PUCK (7825) or visit CyclonesHockey.com.
http://www.cycloneshockey.com/news/253/cyclones-fall-to-wings-5-1/
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justmom
(The Next Level!)
335 Posts |
Posted - 02/26/2011 : 10:48:48 PM
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<<sigh>>
That was ugly to watch. The boys need to remember to STAY OUT of the box. Out shot the wings and still got beat bad. |
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dbc
(Been Here Awhile)
865 Posts |
Posted - 02/26/2011 : 11:12:14 PM
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| Please please sit Pickard down for the remainder of the season unless we get caught in a three games in three nights situation. He has gotten worse since October when he was awful. |
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hrc666
(Loves To Post!)
1363 Posts |
Posted - 02/27/2011 : 04:45:03 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by dbc
Please please sit Pickard down for the remainder of the season unless we get caught in a three games in three nights situation. He has gotten worse since October when he was awful.
"Worse than awful". Reminds me of an ex's attitude. But, I digress......
I find it hard to believe that Nashville hasn't completely given up on this kid. Could anyone in that organization honestly believe that Pickard will ever wear a Predator's (or any other NHL team's) sweater?
They probably have thrown in the towel on his NHL prospects, but still feel beholden to making the Cyclones play him in the 1 out of 20 chance that he's just in some type of long term funk that he'll ultimately snap out of.
Skalde must be a pretty good beggar as he was able to unload a useless affiliated player like DeLory onto some poor outfit in the CHL. Unfortunately, Pickard is only 21 years old and playing in just his second professional season. That he's still under a fairly lucrative 1st round draft pick's entry-level contract (and probably will be through next season) makes it almost impossible for Skalde to get rid of him or relegate him to door opener. Sending him to the CHL would show Pickard that Nashville has completely given up on him-and given his alleged "confidence problem"-that would be the final nail in his coffin. I don't think that they're gonna do it.
I believe that we are ski rude.
Ah, the joys of affiliation |
Edited by - hrc666 on 02/27/2011 05:00:12 AM |
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cloneinator
(Been Here Awhile)
USA
597 Posts |
Posted - 02/27/2011 : 06:23:18 AM
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This team simply can not win in its own division being something like 12 and 19 so far this year. K-Zoo is on a roll and then some, and I totally agree with HRC in that we are stuck with Pickard and Nashville is going to insist we play him.
I don't know if we could ever get them back, and I will leave that suggestion/debate to more knowledgeable people on here than me, but I would love to try to get the Hamilton/Montreal affiliation back. I have never been a fan of the Nashville connection, and I am not overly impressed with the Florida/Rochester ties either.
Chuck is gone and he has his own fish to fry. Its time to cut the cord and move on if there is a move the team can make in the off season that is more beneficial. |
...And on the eighth day, GOD created the Cyclones! |
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justmom
(The Next Level!)
335 Posts |
Posted - 02/27/2011 : 10:50:38 AM
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| Florida's affiliation ends with Rochester this year. We will have to wit and see what comes of that during the summer. |
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bhf303
(The Next Level!)
198 Posts |
Posted - 02/27/2011 : 10:52:10 AM
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With Pickard, the team has a better chance of losing than winning. That is very unfortunate for that kid.
Right now, Foster gives them the best chance of winning games.
Unfortunately, I also get the fact that the team may be defenseless to really do anything about it, even as far as the number of games he plays.
It would completely not make any sense for Skalde to play him on a regular basis if he had control of that. |
Somersaults, thats how I roll! |
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elvis77
(Loves To Post!)
1435 Posts |
Posted - 02/27/2011 : 11:28:48 AM
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Perhaps it the team be more responsible defensively the goal tending would look so bad. When you turn the puck over to Kory Karlander (27g-36a-63pts in 54 games) at the bottom of the circle he's going to bury it the vast majority of the time. When you give the opposition more time and space than needed on the PK they will find shooting and passing lanes to score. Last season, Mayer and Smith were finding consistency in their games by March, but if you want to argue that part of their success didn't have something to do with the defensive cohesion in front of them, I'll roll my eyes and laugh at you. Would this years team be better if they had the Mayer and Smith of last season's March/playoffs, perhaps but I maintain that even Mayer and Smith would feel stranded on islands the way this team plays in their own zone.
Hockey is a team sport, but goal tending is an individual position. When the team is terrible in front it's often the goalie that gets blamed when you can usually find fault in someone else's actions that had a direct impact on the play leading to the goal. It's really easy to sit and the stands and blame the goalies. Yes, there are pucks the hit the back of the net they they should have stopped, but that happens at every level. If you talk to people that have actually put on pads you'll find that a solid defense breeds confidence in a goalie, whereas a porous D can shatter it. When a goalie is constantly waiting for the bad turnover or bad bounce it can become a downward spiral.
The bottom line is, the TEAM has to get better defensively as a whole if they are really going to make a run.
As far as returning to the MTL/HAM affiliation, I wouldn't plan on it. I spoke with Skalde about it and he said the main reason for parting ways with the Habs was financial. Apparently it's fairly pricey to transfer players back of forth across the border each time there is a reassignment. Take it for what it's worth but that's what he said.
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"PBR can do that to you....1,2,3,12 beers and you're f**ked"
-oscar
"and i don't give a damn 'bout my bad reputation" - joan jett
"beer is proof that god loves us and wants us to be happy." - benjamin franklin
"is that a pulled pork sandwich i smell?"
"some things are just better without pants...."
www.cycwords.wordpress.com |
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dbc
(Been Here Awhile)
865 Posts |
Posted - 02/27/2011 : 2:21:57 PM
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Sorry Elvis I respectively disagree.
1) Our playoff rivals are Kzoo. Gwinett, Trenton, Elmira, and Toledo.
2) All of them have a worse goals against average than us. We are 13th in the league
3)All of them have a better goals for average than us. We are 15th in the league
4) All of them give up more shots per game than we do. We are third best in the league in that category
5) All of them take more shots per game than we do. We are 11th
This says to me we are suffering more from poor offense than poor defense. We have the best goals against average and the worst goals for average of the all the teams fighting for the last few playoff slots.
That doesn't mean we dont have defensive problems. You feel that the defensive problem has more to do with the defensive corps than the goaltending. Your point is that our defense breaks down too often and the goalies are left at their mercy. As an ex goalie I appreciate you defending our goalies (and I can tell you tongue in cheek all goals I allowed were someone else's fault,) but I think the corps has done a pretty good job even strength with the third lowest amount of shots allowed per game in the league. To me the problem has been goaltending. The truth is the goalie has two jobs that distinguish one from the other from the other where a half a goal difference allowed per game is a big difference: A) Don't let in any soft goals and B) make the big save when the defense does break down which it is always going to do for a certain percentage of the shots each game.
Chet does neither. He has let in way too many soft goals as he doesn't react to the puck for a save--he drops and HOPES to block it. He is slow from side to side as seen by the large number of cross ice goals he gave up early, and to make up for this he now often cheats off the near post and gets beat short sided. Foster on the other hand is excellent holding the short side and quicker side to side. He also reacts to the puck and is better controlling rebounds. He has made more big saves in the four games I have seen than Chet has a long time. Is he the answer? I don't know but seeing as he plays behind the same defense Chet does no matter how good or bad that corps might be, he has over a goal per game better average and a dramatic better save percentage (.922 vs.881) and should be playing as much as he is able until he proves is can't keep his stats stronger than Chet's. |
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cloneinator
(Been Here Awhile)
USA
597 Posts |
Posted - 02/27/2011 : 2:58:43 PM
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I love to watch to a conversation like Elvis and dbc. You guys both make great points and have the knowledge and information to back up what you say. I guess that's what this site is all about.
The one thing that doesn't make any sense is the cost issue Skalde told Elvis about with getting players across the border. I don't see how it is any cheaper with Wheeling than in Cincinnati. |
...And on the eighth day, GOD created the Cyclones! |
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elvis77
(Loves To Post!)
1435 Posts |
Posted - 02/27/2011 : 3:48:02 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by cloneinator
I love to watch to a conversation like Elvis and dbc. You guys both make great points and have the knowledge and information to back up what you say. I guess that's what this site is all about.
The one thing that doesn't make any sense is the cost issue Skalde told Elvis about with getting players across the border. I don't see how it is any cheaper with Wheeling than in Cincinnati.
It's not cheaper for Wheeling to do it, they just have decided to accept the cost whereas the Clones front office decided to save some money and go a different way. According to Skalde it has to do with the immigration and work permits.
@dbc - I would have to redo the math to see where it stands now, but when I did it early in the month here's what I saw....
Individually this years squad has similar ppg as last years, more defensive, grind it out team. Last, year Kilpatrick was the only player over 1 ppg but he spent time injured, called up or in Weber's dog house due to poor defensive play. For the sake of my argument I'll combine CPZ and Dylan Hunter together and the basically equal Killer's offensive production. What I'm getting at is last years team didn't have any superstars but Weber put systems in place to allow them to succeed, it wasn't always exciting but it worked. This years team also lacks a true game changing player, it's a similar type lineup yet Skalde has them playing a much more open flowing type of game. It's been leading to turnovers which lead to odd man rushes and goals or penalties which lead to giving up power plays and goals. Once the the guys get set up in the offensive zone they can control the play but yes, have had issues finishing. Defensively it's similar, once they get the D set up they have been doing a much better job stifling the to the perimeter. The issue is the transition out of the zone and through the neutral zone. Skalde has everyone flying forward and when there is a turn over bad things happen. There is often times little support behind the puck as a safety valve.
Moreover, when comparing last years defensive style of play to this years attempt at offense I found (again based on some old math so these numbers may have changed slightly) This years teams goals scored per game was only down .43 gpg (2.83 to 3.26), while the goals allowed was up .57 (3.35 to 2.78). I will concede that if the offense is putting less than 3 goals per game it makes it hard to win and leaves little margin for error or mistake. However, even when they do score 3, the opposition ends up scoring 4 because Skalde has them selling out offensively to get the puck up the ice. How many times have the Cyclones give up late goals to either lose a chance to head to OT or head to OT rather than win in regulation? I have lost count personally.
Last years squad had active 14 players finish the season with + ratings. Currently this years team only has 8 and of them of them CPZ is technically a + but is even with the Cyclones, Mahbod is in the + but is -2 since joining the team, and Kattelus is +1 but with a very small sample size of games played (11).
I'm not against improving the offense but unless they are going to start scoring 4 or 5 goals per game they had better improve the defense as well. I would prefer to see the improvement in the defensive end first simply because defensive hockey wins championships. |
"PBR can do that to you....1,2,3,12 beers and you're f**ked"
-oscar
"and i don't give a damn 'bout my bad reputation" - joan jett
"beer is proof that god loves us and wants us to be happy." - benjamin franklin
"is that a pulled pork sandwich i smell?"
"some things are just better without pants...."
www.cycwords.wordpress.com |
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dbc
(Been Here Awhile)
865 Posts |
Posted - 02/27/2011 : 3:57:59 PM
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| Elvis--think we are in agreement on a lot but whether the goaltending is making the defense look bad or vice versa. Guess I feel if jeremy was here this year GOAA would be down half a goal per game with the same defense and we would be talking about hoping for top 4 seeding rather than hoping to make the playoffs. Hope Foster turns out to have the same skills. |
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Donnie Hockey
(Loves To Post!)
USA
1514 Posts |
Posted - 02/27/2011 : 5:27:01 PM
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You could put Ryan Miller in goal for the Cyclones and his numbers would be pedestrian-like if the defensive play in front of him were as Elvis describes. And it probably is.
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www.twitter.com/donhelbig |
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bhf303
(The Next Level!)
198 Posts |
Posted - 02/27/2011 : 5:54:04 PM
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Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, and I don't know what the problem is, but based on the arguments presented, it seems that our goalies, who are NHL prosepects, are being trained in a system that does not cater for a great deal of goalie success.
Maybe I'm not getting my point or question out right, but it seems like this system places alot of pressure on the goalie and it would require strong play from him.
If he is not getting that strong play in front of him then, how does the NHL parent team view his play? Is he doomed because of the support cast, or does the affiliate say its time to send him elsewhere?
Do you continue to keep your prospect in a place where the support cast is causing the problems? |
Somersaults, thats how I roll! |
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Donnie Hockey
(Loves To Post!)
USA
1514 Posts |
Posted - 02/27/2011 : 6:27:40 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by bhf303
If he is not getting that strong play in front of him then, how does the NHL parent team view his play?
An NHL organization is more concerned with a prospects attitude, work ethic, preparation, how they responds after giving up a bad goal or bad shift and/or game, and if they're getting better at the things they've asked them to work on including learning to be a pro than they are the player's stats.
If an NHL organization has a player in the ECHL and they think the culture isn't right for their development, they'll place the player somewhere else.
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www.twitter.com/donhelbig |
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dbc
(Been Here Awhile)
865 Posts |
Posted - 02/27/2011 : 7:01:22 PM
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Thanks Donnie. Interesting concept. I look forward to Pickard being called up by Buffalo soon to back up Ryan Miller as both would have the same type numbers at the same level with the same defense in front of them. Also look forward to seeing him playing in the next Olympics.
Elvis and I have an honest disagreement as to if the defense or goaltending hurts us more. Both of us watch the same games from our seats. And how many Cyclone games have you seen this year and how many did Chet play in for you to make your evaluation of our defense and goaltending?
Elmira is now 3-0 since firing Cameron and jumped back ahead of us. Can't underestimate what goes on in the locker room--or playing Trenton. The Devils have now lost three games this weekend to teams we are fighting with for the playoffs. |
Edited by - dbc on 02/27/2011 7:06:33 PM |
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